{"id":121015,"date":"2019-12-04T09:31:45","date_gmt":"2019-12-04T15:31:45","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/?p=121015"},"modified":"2025-02-03T08:37:14","modified_gmt":"2025-02-03T14:37:14","slug":"bisa-butler-artist-interview","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/","title":{"rendered":"Bisa Butler On Her Approach to &#8216;Painting with Fabric&#8217;"},"content":{"rendered":"\n<div class=\"wp-block-group alignfull is-style-default entry-header is-vertical is-layout-flex wp-container-core-group-is-layout-fe9cc265 wp-block-group-is-layout-flex\"><figure class=\"colo-post-featured-image wp-block-post-featured-image\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"1920\" height=\"1280\" src=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-1.jpg\" class=\"attachment-post-thumbnail size-post-thumbnail wp-post-image\" alt=\"a vibrant quilt portrait of a family of four by bisa butler\" style=\"object-fit:cover;\" srcset=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-1.jpg 1920w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-1-640x427.jpg 640w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-1-960x640.jpg 960w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-1-1536x1024.jpg 1536w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 1920px) 100vw, 1920px\" \/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\"><\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-group post-title is-vertical is-layout-flex wp-container-core-group-is-layout-0bc941e6 wp-block-group-is-layout-flex\"><h1 class=\"alignfull wp-block-post-title\">Bisa Butler On Her Approach to &#8216;Painting with Fabric&#8217;<\/h1>\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-group alignfull post-meta is-layout-flex wp-block-group-is-layout-flex\"><div class=\"wp-block-post-date\"><time datetime=\"2019-12-04T09:31:45-06:00\">December 4, 2019<\/time><\/div>\n\n<div class=\"taxonomy-category wp-block-post-terms\"><a class=\"category-art\" href=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/category\/art\/\" rel=\"tag\">Art<\/a><a class=\"category-conversations\" href=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/category\/conversations\/\" rel=\"tag\">Conversations<\/a><a class=\"category-social-issues\" href=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/category\/social-issues\/\" rel=\"tag\">Social Issues<\/a><\/div>\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-post-author-name\"><a href=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/author\/laura\/\" target=\"_self\" class=\"wp-block-post-author-name__link\">Laura Staugaitis<\/a><\/div><\/div>\n<\/div>\n\n\n\n<div class=\"wp-block-group alignfull post-share-group is-layout-flow wp-block-group-is-layout-flow\">\n<div class=\"wp-block-group is-nowrap is-layout-flex wp-container-core-group-is-layout-6c531013 wp-block-group-is-layout-flex\">\n<ul class=\"wp-block-outermost-social-sharing has-visible-labels has-icon-color is-style-logos-only is-layout-flex wp-block-outermost-social-sharing-is-layout-flex\"><li style=\"color: #1c1e0d; \" class=\"outermost-social-sharing-link outermost-social-sharing-link-facebook has-crow-color wp-block-outermost-social-sharing-link\">\n\t<a href=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/sharer\/sharer.php?u=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thisiscolossal.com%2F2019%2F12%2Fbisa-butler-artist-interview%2F&#038;title=Bisa%20Butler%20On%20Her%20Approach%20to%20%26%238216%3BPainting%20with%20Fabric%27\" aria-label=\"Share\" rel=\"noopener nofollow\" target=\"_blank\" class=\"wp-block-outermost-social-sharing-link-anchor\">\n\t\t<svg width=\"24\" height=\"24\" viewBox=\"0 0 24 24\" version=\"1.1\" xmlns=\"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg\" aria-hidden=\"true\" focusable=\"false\"><path d=\"M12 2C6.5 2 2 6.5 2 12c0 5 3.7 9.1 8.4 9.9v-7H7.9V12h2.5V9.8c0-2.5 1.5-3.9 3.8-3.9 1.1 0 2.2.2 2.2.2v2.5h-1.3c-1.2 0-1.6.8-1.6 1.6V12h2.8l-.4 2.9h-2.3v7C18.3 21.1 22 17 22 12c0-5.5-4.5-10-10-10z\"><\/path><\/svg>\t\t<span class=\"wp-block-outermost-social-sharing-link-label \">\n\t\t\tShare\t\t<\/span>\n\t<\/a>\n<\/li>\n\n\n<li style=\"color: #1c1e0d; \" class=\"outermost-social-sharing-link outermost-social-sharing-link-mail has-crow-color wp-block-outermost-social-sharing-link\">\n\t<a href=\"mailto:?subject=Bisa%20Butler%20On%20Her%20Approach%20to%20%26%238216%3BPainting%20with%20Fabric%27&#038;body=Bisa%20Butler%20On%20Her%20Approach%20to%20%26%238216%3BPainting%20with%20Fabric%27%20&mdash;%20https%3A%2F%2Fwww.thisiscolossal.com%2F2019%2F12%2Fbisa-butler-artist-interview%2F\" aria-label=\"Email\"  class=\"wp-block-outermost-social-sharing-link-anchor\">\n\t\t<svg width=\"24\" height=\"24\" viewBox=\"0 0 24 24\" version=\"1.1\" xmlns=\"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg\" aria-hidden=\"true\" focusable=\"false\"><path d=\"M20,4H4C2.895,4,2,4.895,2,6v12c0,1.105,0.895,2,2,2h16c1.105,0,2-0.895,2-2V6C22,4.895,21.105,4,20,4z M20,8.236l-8,4.882 L4,8.236V6h16V8.236z\"><\/path><\/svg>\t\t<span class=\"wp-block-outermost-social-sharing-link-label \">\n\t\t\tEmail\t\t<\/span>\n\t<\/a>\n<\/li>\n<\/ul>\n\n\n<button class=\"simplefavorite-button preset\" data-postid=\"121015\" data-siteid=\"1\" data-groupid=\"1\" data-favoritecount=\"0\" style=\"\"><i class=\"sf-icon-bookmark\" style=\"\"><\/i>Bookmark<\/button>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n<\/div>\n\n\n\n<p><a href=\"https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/bisabutler\/\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Bisa Butler<\/a> (<a href=\"\/tags\/bisa-butler\/\">previously<\/a>) shares her fascinating journey with fiber art, African textile traditions, and historical portraiture in an interview with Laura Staugaitis. Drawing from university training with both AfriCOBRA artists and feminist fiber artists, Butler has carved her own path as an exhibiting artist with vibrant and evocative quilts.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura: <\/strong>What have you been working on lately? What are you thinking about these days?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I&#8217;m working on a small group of eight pieces that are going to be debuted in Harlem in March, when I have my first solo show at Claire Oliver Gallery. So I&#8217;m crunching right now. I&#8217;ve finished putting them together and then the sewing I do after. Putting them together takes about 200 hours. It&#8217;s just really slow and painstaking. The sewing I can do in two days, about sixteen hours total. That part is so rewarding and so much faster.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> Do you tack things down? How do you get everything to stay in place?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I use fabric glue. If you slather it on, it has its own texture: shiny, flaky, lumpy. It can change the fabric, but I want my fabric to be soft. I put the glue on using a straight pin, just tiny dots of glue. That&#8217;s why it takes so long. It&#8217;s cutting things smaller than your finger nail and then putting them on with a straight pin and glue. I could have been a surgeon, or I could have been an artist!<\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-image alignnone wp-image-120891 size-full\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"1507\" height=\"1920\" src=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-4.jpg\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-120891\" srcset=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-4.jpg 1507w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-4-640x815.jpg 640w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-4-960x1223.jpg 960w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-4-1206x1536.jpg 1206w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 1507px) 100vw, 1507px\" \/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\">Kindred, 2019. Quilted and appliqu\u00e9d cotton, wool and chiffon. 60 x 84 x 1 in | 152.4 x 213.4 x 2.5 cm. Courtesy Claire Oliver Gallery<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> Is your whole family creative?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> My immediate family\u2014father, mother, brothers and sisters\u2014none of them were creative by profession, but my mother sewed. She taught me to sew. She grew up in Morocco, which is very Francophone, so she grew up in the \u201860s looking at Vogue and Elle, and she and her sisters would look at Yves Saint Laurent gowns and make their own for their parties. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>My husband\u2019s family is not creative either, but he\u2019s a DJ, and I\u2019m an artist, so our kids are creative. We grew into being more practical, but her dad and I got married senior year of college\u2014\u201cwe\u2019re so in love! It\u2019s going to be so easy!\u201d We were just not the most practical of folks. But you\u2019ve gotta have the dreamers and the realists.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> Was your mom\u2019s upbringing in Morocco something that translated into your experience at all, or was it just a normal part of your family story?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> She grew up in the \u201850s and \u201860s with her nine siblings. My grandfather was a U.S. Emissary. My dad is from Ghana. He is a Ghanaian immigrant. So both of my parents grew up outside the United States, although my father is 100% Ghanaian, whereas my mother was a U.S. citizen living in Morocco. Definitely that changed their diet. When we would go to my grandmother\u2019s house for dinner, we would have chicken and olives and tagines. And mint tea. Food was definitely a way that cultural identity gets changed. We grew up with couscous instead of rice. That\u2019s what we thought was normal.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Our parents and relatives were always going back and forth. My one uncle went to work for the Peace Corps. Six of my mother\u2019s sisters married African men. Everyone was always bringing things back. In Africa, you get all your clothes tailored. When you go on a trip, when you come back you have a suitcase full of tailored clothing, and then your linens\u2014tablecloths, napkins, all custom made. If there\u2019s a big event, like a wedding, everyone gets an outfit made with the same fabric. That was something I was just used to seeing. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>My female relatives always wore African caftans around the house. All of their stories were about memories, places and people in Africa that they knew decades ago. All their friends, their references, their school, everything. So I had this image of what it was like to live there, through their stories\u2014a lot more than my dad. He doesn\u2019t talk that much, so you have to pull it out of him. My dad lives about three minutes from here\u2014or I should say, I live about three minutes from him. We bought a house close by. So he was just over last night, looking at my new pieces and giving his two cents.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> Were your parents supportive of you pursuing a creative career?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> They were supportive. My whole life, they would say, \u201cThis is my daughter. She\u2019s an artist!\u201d and I\u2019d be, like, three. My mom and dad always encouraged that. My Christmas list always consisted of some sort of art supplies. Going into college, my dad wanted me to be able to survive, so he convinced me to go to school for architecture. It\u2019s art-related but also affords a steady job. I got excited about it, but I had no idea what it even consisted of, what classes would be like. I was on a full-ride academic scholarship for architecture. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>And I got there and just hated it. Everyone was engineers, mathematicians. They were not my kind of people. Even the building was made of this white marble, and it felt so austere and cold. Everything was so quiet in there. It was hushed. The rules! It was horrible. So I switched over to art.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-image alignnone wp-image-120894 size-full\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"2000\" height=\"1369\" src=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-7.jpg\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-120894\" srcset=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-7.jpg 2000w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-7-640x438.jpg 640w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-7-960x657.jpg 960w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-7-1536x1051.jpg 1536w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 2000px) 100vw, 2000px\" \/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\">&#8221; Daughter of the Dust&#8221; (2019) cotton, wool, silk and velvet and approximately 50\u201d x 90\u201d. Artwork courtesy the artist<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> It\u2019s much more of a technical than a creative pursuit.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> Yes, especially in the foundation classes. So after one year, I came home and told my dad that I was miserable. I was in tears, saying I wanted to switch to art. He agreed and let me switch. But I lost my scholarship. In those days, I think my tuition was $12,000 a year at Howard, and now it\u2019s $48,000. It was a lot of money for him, still, but it\u2019s a different conversation now.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> And you got into the use of fabric when you had your daughter. Have you ever looked back from that decision, or was it more of a homecoming, of \u201cthis is exactly what I want to do\u201d?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> Definitely. This is what it should have been. I had started using fabric in my undergrad. My senior year, one of my professors advised me to look at Romare Bearden. He had this series called Mecklenburg, which is this county in North Carolina. Bearden had this long career and did all kinds of things, but in that particular series, he was using fabric and watercolor and newspaper. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>My professor suggested using fabric pieces in my paintings. So I used gel medium to add in fabric onto my canvas. It was the beginning, but it didn\u2019t click to me about being fully immersed into cloth. They had strict rules then, that if you\u2019re a painting major, then your artwork should be more than 50% paint. Mine was literally 50\/50. Half the faculty, in my final review, said, \u201cShe\u2019s not painting. How can we award her the degree when she\u2019s not actually painting?\u201d The other half were kind of on my side, saying, \u201cShe is painting; she\u2019s painting with fabric.\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>I didn\u2019t quite get it until I went to grad school at Montclair State. Montclair State is a regular PWI (primarily white institution). It\u2019s a state school with a really strong fiber arts program formed by female professors in the \u201870s. That was my first exposure to the feminist art ideals. At Howard, most of my professors were members of AfriCOBRA. Their aesthetic was Afrocentric, African-inspired artwork. At Montclair, the fibers program was really women-centered, \u201cwomen\u2019s work.\u201d That was really different for me. I hadn\u2019t been in these studios with rooms full of yarn. It was there that I got the idea. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>To finish your Master\u2019s, everyone had to take one studio class in fibers, and in that class you had to felt, knit, weave, make a quilt, screen-print on fabric, and do some batik and hand dying. In that class, I made a small quilt, and that was when it really clicked, and I haven\u2019t looked back because it felt like \u201cthis is right.\u201d Canvas was totally obsolete for me. Paintbrushes, paint: I couldn\u2019t even use those things when I had my daughter. I was nauseous when I was pregnant, and when she was a little tiny girl it was too dangerous. I couldn\u2019t have all those things around her.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> It\u2019s been interesting seeing how craft has entered the fine art lexicon in the last few years. Is that something you\u2019ve been noticing or thinking about?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I\u2019ve definitely noticed that going to the fairs. When you\u2019re walking around, I would always try to count how many fiber pieces I saw. Even in 2016 at the Armory Show, I might have seen maybe four or five fibers pieces throughout the whole show. And not all of them were really all that well done. It was just that they were there. And then this year at EXPO Chicago, I didn\u2019t even need to count any more. I couldn\u2019t count it on two hands. It\u2019s really incredible. I have been exhibiting for a long time, since 2002, at local shows and craft fairs. Sometimes people would come up to me and say \u201cso when are you going to start making art again?\u201d At my exhibit! And I would be shocked, but they didn\u2019t consider what I was doing art.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> It didn\u2019t even occur to them that that was a rude question.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I remember one time I was exhibiting my student\u2019s work and this guy came up and he was looking at the work, and he said, \u201cSo, if you\u2019re the art teacher, do you also make art?\u201d And I said, \u201cYes, I make fiber art.\u201d And he goes, \u201cOh, your students are drawing and painting like this? It must be interesting having students doing things you can\u2019t.\u201d And I was stunned! Who do you think taught them? He just assumed that because I worked in fibers that meant that I couldn\u2019t draw or paint.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> It\u2019s the same as Picasso\u2014he was an amazing draftsperson. But you\u2019re making an aesthetic choice. It\u2019s not that you just can\u2019t do the work.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I love that Basquiat quote, \u201cbelieve it or not, I can actually draw.\u201d Because people look at your work and think you can\u2019t. Now that the craft movement is being accepted as fine art has made life a lot easier for me. I have a museum show coming up in March at the Katonah Museum. I have a gallery show as well. With the museum show, my work is going to be in a contemporary wing. That\u2019s different\u2014I didn\u2019t realize it was different\u2014but the curators were telling me that before, that wouldn\u2019t have been done.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-image alignnone wp-image-120889 size-full\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"1229\" height=\"1920\" src=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-2.jpg\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-120889\" srcset=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-2.jpg 1229w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-2-640x1000.jpg 640w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-2-960x1500.jpg 960w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-2-983x1536.jpg 983w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 1229px) 100vw, 1229px\" \/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\">The Equestrian, 2019. Quilted and appliqu\u00e9d cotton, wool and chiffon. 43 x 68 x 1 in | 109.2 x 172.7 x 2.5 cm. Courtesy Claire Oliver Gallery<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> What are the pieces that you\u2019re working on for these shows. Is there a theme or body of work that you\u2019re focusing on?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-pullquote\"><blockquote><p>When I find these photos of free people or people in school or in Europe, I\u2019m curious to know how they got there and what their life was like. It upends the story we\u2019ve all been told of what life was like for Black people at that time.<\/p><cite>Bisa Butler<\/cite><\/blockquote><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> Not so much a particular theme. I\u2019m letting it emerge based on the photos I\u2019m working with. I\u2019m very heavily reliant on vintage photographs. Sometimes I get in eras. This particular era is 1860 and World War One. My last series, all my pieces were based in World War II, except for one. My biggest piece from the last series was baseball players from 1899. That really spurred curiosity in me about what life was like for African-Americans pre-Civil War. Not just as enslaved people. When I find these photos of free people or people in school or in Europe, I\u2019m curious to know how they got there and what their life was like. It upends the story we\u2019ve all been told of what life was like for Black people at that time.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> The single narrative.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> Yeah, I\u2019m looking at one right now. It\u2019s titled \u201cFree Men of Color\u201d and was taken in 1850 in Louisiana. This guy has on a brocade vest and a wool jacket. They both have on fancy cravats. Before they went to Morocco, my mom\u2019s family was from New Orleans, so there were a lot of free African-Americans and free mixed people of color. But there\u2019s not that many photos, so it\u2019s interesting to see it, to see how contemporary they look and the expressions on their faces. These are people who are comfortable in their skin and in their life in a time when 90% of black people were not.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-image alignnone wp-image-120892 size-full\"><img decoding=\"async\" src=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-5.jpg\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-120892\"\/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\">The Safety Patrol, 2018. Quilted and appliqu\u00e9d cotton, wool and chiffon. 90 x 82 in | 228.6 x 208.3 cm. Courtesy Claire Oliver Gallery<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> When you\u2019re working from the photograph, are you trying to translate the specific essence of that person in the picture? Or is it more a kind of general history reference that you\u2019re interpreting.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I am trying to get them. I\u2019m trying to understand the individual person. By studying their photos when I\u2019m working on them\u2014200 hours, 300 hours\u2014I\u2019m really examining them in a forensic way. You start to notice things about them that no one may have noticed in a long time. Like if they have a pinkie finger that appears to be stiff, I think about maybe this person\u2019s pinkie was paralyzed and didn\u2019t bend like the rest of their fingers, that something happened there. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>The clothes themselves give me a lot of clues, too. Someone wearing a really fancy cravat, like these guys are\u2014you start to realize their personality. This guy really took time to look really dandified for this photo, with a tie pin and cuff links. You see the attention to their appearance. It really speaks to who this person is and how they care about themselves. I start looking at myself in this era. Our clothes are a lot less complicated. Some of them, I look at them and think, \u201cDamn, what they\u2019re wearing is probably better than anything I have in my closet.\u201d I try to make sure I\u2019m looking at them as equals, and as I\u2019m studying them, I\u2019m thinking, \u201cI\u2019m not sure if we\u2019re on the same plane or not!\u201d I find myself looking at them and feeling a little shabby!<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> What draws you to the different photos you use? How do you go about sourcing them and how you choose, of the things that you find, the image you want to spend 200 hours with?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> Initially, I used family photos. I was in school or fresh out of school and I wanted to show my appreciation. I made a portrait of my grandmother and then my dad\u2014they were gifts. And then looking at their old photos, which were always black and white. That interest is still with me. I like the mystery of it, trying to figure out, \u201cWho was this person? Were they funny? Were they stern? Was this the class clown?\u201d Trying to figure out those kinds of quirks. Especially if everyone who knew this person was gone and they\u2019re not famous, that\u2019s not necessarily included in any written document, and sometimes not even a name.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>I mostly use public databases like the National Archives and Library of Congress because I need photographs that are for public consumption. I look for things that have something special that\u2019s drawing me in to the person in the photo. Not deliberately, but because I grew up looking at my grandmother\u2019s photos of her childhood in New Orleans, and her grandmother and her great-grandmother and her cousins, I\u2019m looking for things that spark something in me. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>Some of it might be because they look like images that I\u2019ve seen but I don\u2019t remember. Like the baseball players, when I first saw them, I thought I was looking at a photo from the Negro League. We all know about Jackie Robinson and when he came to the Dodgers, but I thought this was a photo of him from before baseball was desegregated. Then I saw the caption read Morris Brown College Baseball Team, 1899. I was shocked\u2014the Negro Leagues weren\u2019t even formed at that time and these guys were playing baseball in college. This was 37 years after slavery, so it would be a big deal for them to be in college at all. They were going to segregated college in the South\u2014Morris Brown is in Atlanta\u2014 during that time, they had lynching and race riots, and these guys are playing baseball\u2014our pastime, but they can\u2019t even vote. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>When I saw the date I knew I had to do the piece. It was a personal challenge, too, because it has ten people, and I hadn\u2019t done a piece that large.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> How much does a piece change from when you start it to when you are done? Do you have a sense in your mind of what it will be like?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I actually don\u2019t have a preconceived notion of what it\u2019s going to look like. I don\u2019t visualize that. I sometimes have particular fabrics that I want to use. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>I just finished a soldier from World War One who fought for the French, and he had on this very traditional outfit. He looks like he is Senegalese or from Guinea, somewhere from West Africa, just based on his features. The main fabric that I chose from his outfit is called Kofi Anan\u2019s Brain and the fabric actually looks like if you took CAT scan images of the brain. It\u2019s a West African fabric that was made when Kofi Anan became the U.N. Secretary General and West Africans were so enraptured with this man and the way that he spoke that they made this fabric commemorating his inauguration. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>I definitely wanted to put <em>Kofi Anan\u2019s Brain<\/em> fabric on this soldier because he\u2019s an African who fought for the French during World War I and they used them in the front lines so they would be the first in the skirmishes and suffered heavy casualties. Because his own country would have been colonized at the time. He wasn\u2019t free at home, and so he shipped off to Paris to fight in the front. His name wasn\u2019t recorded, so I don\u2019t know if he survived the war or not. I wanted to increase the dialogue when people look at him. Especially West African women who wear this fabric will know when they see it. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>On his pants, there\u2019s another fabric called <em>Nkrumah\u2019s Pencil<\/em>. Ghana was the first African colony to gain its independence, in 1957, and Kwame Nkrumah was the first president, also known for writing a new constitution for a free Africa. He was interested in all of the colonies in Africa becoming free. Because of what those fabrics mean, I really wanted to be sure I used them on the soldier and made allowances for them\u2014these are on here, everything else will follow them.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-image alignnone wp-image-120893 size-full\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"1920\" height=\"1440\" src=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-6.jpg\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-120893\" srcset=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-6.jpg 1920w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-6-640x480.jpg 640w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-6-960x720.jpg 960w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-6-1536x1152.jpg 1536w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-6-285x214.jpg 285w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 1920px) 100vw, 1920px\" \/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\">The Safety Patrol (detail), 2018. Quilted and appliqu\u00e9d cotton, wool and chiffon. 90 x 82 in | 228.6 x 208.3 cm. Courtesy Claire Oliver Gallery<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> Where do you get your fabrics from?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I order them directly from the manufacturer. There\u2019s a company in Ghana that I really like, and one in Cote D&#8217;IVoire, a fabric company in Holland that makes a bunch of the Dutch waxes. There\u2019s a Nigerian company that I really like but that I have to order that from London.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> Have you ever thought about designing your own fabric, or do you like working with a predetermined set of materials?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I would love to, but there is so much time involved in that. I got involved in surface design just shortly after I had taken that fiber arts class. I bought some dyes to use at home and some bleach pens to bleach in my own patterns, but it was so messy and I was in my washroom doing it. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>There was one day I was in the washroom and my kids were small at the time, maybe they were about three and six, they were upstairs and I realized, \u201cNo, I\u2019m gonna just buy the fabric. I was downstairs for a couple hours, and little kids, you can\u2019t leave them for very long.\u201d Any art that would take me from being able to observe my children was counterproductive. I remember going upstairs and deciding from that moment on, that I would just find the fabric that I wanted. There are enough manufacturers and enough designers and some people hand-dye. I have a good friend who creates hand-dyed fabric in New Hampshire and sends me some.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> The time it takes to gain mastery is just so long to get the exact look and pattern that you want.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> In 2005 I did a break dancer. I was going to do a series of all hip-hop breakers\u2014I still might go back to that one day. I decided to spray-paint fabric so I would have my own actual spray-painted fabric to use in the quilt. What an unmitigated disaster! I totally second-guessed being able to control spray-paint. I had no idea what it was going to be. I didn\u2019t have any specialty nozzles. I didn\u2019t do any research. I approached it in a very ignorant manner and it shows so, [laughs] I didn\u2019t do that again.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<figure class=\"wp-block-image alignnone wp-image-120890 size-full\"><img loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" width=\"1258\" height=\"1920\" src=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-3.jpg\" alt=\"\" class=\"wp-image-120890\" srcset=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-3.jpg 1258w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-3-640x977.jpg 640w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-3-960x1466.jpg 960w, https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-3-1006x1536.jpg 1006w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 1258px) 100vw, 1258px\" \/><figcaption class=\"wp-element-caption\">Dear Mama (detail), 2019. Quilted and appliqu\u00e9d cotton, wool and chiffon. 53 x 78 x 1 in | 134.6 x 198.1 x 2.5 cm. Courtesy Claire Oliver Gallery<\/figcaption><\/figure>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> Wrapping up, is there something about your work or practice that you don\u2019t get asked about a lot?<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> I always try to portray African-Americans in a positive light in my artwork. Even if the photo that I originally looked at wasn\u2019t necessarily in a flattering light in the gaze of the photographer. I\u2019ll look at photos, say, of Depression-era people on line for free soup. In the way I would portray them, I always think about them as an actual person who I\u2019m having a conversation with. So I\u2019ll fix their hair, and fix up their clothing. I don\u2019t show my people with ragged clothing, which sometimes they did originally have. Sometimes they either had no shoes or holes in their shoes, so I\u2019ll change that. <\/p>\n\n\n\n<p>I\u2019m thinking about myself as somebody who is telling the story of this person and I don\u2019t want it to be that the last known photo of them is when they were really struggling. There are other moments that we\u2019re not privy to. It\u2019s important for me to portray people in a positive light.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Laura:<\/strong> Especially things about physical adornment or grooming can not have anything to do with who that individual is as a person and have more to do with the access to resources that has or has not been granted to them by society at large.<\/p>\n\n\n\n<p><strong>Bisa:<\/strong> If somebody were to come by here and take my picture today [in my studio clothes], I would not be happy. I\u2019d be like, \u201cWait! I can look better!\u201d<\/p>\n\n\n\n<hr class=\"wp-block-separator has-alpha-channel-opacity\"\/>\n\n\n\n<p>You can follow the artist on <a href=\"https:\/\/www.instagram.com\/bisabutler\/?hl=en\" target=\"_blank\" rel=\"noopener noreferrer\">Instagram<\/a>.<\/p>\n","protected":false},"excerpt":{"rendered":"<p>Bisa Butler (previously) shares her fascinating journey with fiber art, African textile traditions, and historical portraiture in an interview with Laura Staugaitis. Drawing from university training with both AfriCOBRA artists and feminist fiber artists, Butler has carved her own path as an exhibiting artist with vibrant and evocative quilts. Laura: What have you been working<a href=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/\">Continue reading <span class=\"sr-only\">&#8220;Bisa Butler On Her Approach to &#8216;Painting with Fabric&#8217;&#8221;<\/span><\/a><\/p>\n","protected":false},"author":18,"featured_media":120888,"comment_status":"closed","ping_status":"closed","sticky":false,"template":"","format":"standard","meta":{"_acf_changed":false,"inline_featured_image":false,"footnotes":""},"categories":[493,3357,3099],"tags":[2257,3653,775,1814,409],"class_list":["post-121015","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-art","category-conversations","category-social-issues","tag-bisa-butler","tag-black-history-month","tag-fabric","tag-fiber-art","tag-portraits"],"acf":{"acf_sponsor_post":""},"yoast_head":"<!-- This site is optimized with the Yoast SEO Premium plugin v26.9 (Yoast SEO v26.9) - https:\/\/yoast.com\/product\/yoast-seo-premium-wordpress\/ -->\n<title>Bisa Butler On Her Approach to &#039;Painting with Fabric&#039; &#8212; Colossal<\/title>\n<meta name=\"robots\" content=\"index, follow, max-snippet:-1, max-image-preview:large, max-video-preview:-1\" \/>\n<link rel=\"canonical\" href=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:locale\" content=\"en_US\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:type\" content=\"article\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:title\" content=\"Bisa Butler On Her Approach to &#039;Painting with Fabric&#039;\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:description\" content=\"Bisa Butler (previously) shares her fascinating journey with fiber art, African textile traditions, and historical portraiture in an interview with Laura Staugaitis. Drawing from university training with both AfriCOBRA artists and feminist fiber artists, Butler has carved her own path as an exhibiting artist with vibrant and evocative quilts. Laura: What have you been workingContinue reading &quot;Bisa Butler On Her Approach to &#8216;Painting with Fabric&#8217;&quot;\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:url\" content=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:site_name\" content=\"Colossal\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:publisher\" content=\"https:\/\/www.facebook.com\/thisiscolossal\/\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:published_time\" content=\"2019-12-04T15:31:45+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"article:modified_time\" content=\"2025-02-03T14:37:14+00:00\" \/>\n<meta property=\"og:image\" content=\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-1.jpg\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:width\" content=\"1920\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:height\" content=\"1280\" \/>\n\t<meta property=\"og:image:type\" content=\"image\/jpeg\" \/>\n<meta name=\"author\" content=\"Laura Staugaitis\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:card\" content=\"summary_large_image\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:creator\" content=\"@cjobson\" \/>\n<meta name=\"twitter:label1\" content=\"Written by\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data1\" content=\"Laura Staugaitis\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:label2\" content=\"Est. reading time\" \/>\n\t<meta name=\"twitter:data2\" content=\"20 minutes\" \/>\n<script type=\"application\/ld+json\" class=\"yoast-schema-graph\">{\"@context\":\"https:\/\/schema.org\",\"@graph\":[{\"@type\":\"Article\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/#article\",\"isPartOf\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/\"},\"author\":{\"name\":\"Laura Staugaitis\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/#\/schema\/person\/c016d33dc1969689674340a131e0126f\"},\"headline\":\"Bisa Butler On Her Approach to &#8216;Painting with Fabric&#8217;\",\"datePublished\":\"2019-12-04T15:31:45+00:00\",\"dateModified\":\"2025-02-03T14:37:14+00:00\",\"mainEntityOfPage\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/\"},\"wordCount\":4031,\"publisher\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/#organization\"},\"image\":{\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/#primaryimage\"},\"thumbnailUrl\":\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/wp-content\/uploads\/2019\/12\/bisa-1.jpg\",\"keywords\":[\"Bisa Butler\",\"Black History Month\",\"fabric\",\"fiber art\",\"portraits\"],\"articleSection\":[\"Art\",\"Conversations\",\"Social Issues\"],\"inLanguage\":\"en-US\"},{\"@type\":\"WebPage\",\"@id\":\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/\",\"url\":\"https:\/\/www.thisiscolossal.com\/2019\/12\/bisa-butler-artist-interview\/\",\"name\":\"Bisa Butler On Her Approach to 'Painting with Fabric' &#8212; 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Drawing from university training with both AfriCOBRA artists and feminist fiber artists, Butler has carved her own path as an exhibiting artist with vibrant and evocative quilts. 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